"Get Your Hair Outta My Face"

by Eric Disco
Apr 23

This is an article from my friend Hurricane Lee.

Some of you on this site have asked me to break down a good interaction.

Some time ago, Eric and I were at a rooftop bar, a place with a particularly stunning view.

Next to us are three women (later joined by one more).

One of the women has her back to me, but I see her when she came in.

She is tall and smoking hot, wearing a beautiful dress.

I am 45. She is 25, as I will find out later.

I don’t like to open conversation with women who are not looking at me.  But this woman just won’t turn towards me.

I get my chance when she starts to put her hair up in a knot.

When women are that hot, it’s ok to open with something negative.

The Negative Opener

Me: “Get your hair out of my face, sister.”

She: (Steps to my side) “Oh. I am sorry.”

Me: (Ignoring her and pointing at the incredible skyline she just revealed by stepping out of my way) “Look at that. That is fucking gorgeous. This city is my one true love and no woman will ever replace her.”

She laughs. I laugh. Her girlfriends are playing with my skull bracelet (I like to wear stuff that gets women’ attention).

The hot woman and I start talking.

Refusing To Follow the Hot Girl Script

I am not playing along with the hot girl script. I am not giving her the validation she expects.

I’m not telling her how smart she is, how accomplished she is. I’m doing things that show she still has to work for it.

A few times, she tries to reign me in.

For example, I do this thing where I let my eyes wander while we’re talking. Only when I want to reward her do I give her brief but intense eye contact.

She is totally unaccustomed to this lack of attention.

At one point, she snaps her fingers in front of my nose and says “Hey! My eyes are right here.”

I stretch my arm out to present the beautiful city. “Look! Look at all you have to compete with. You’re going to have to work for that attention,” I say.

We laugh. There’s a little tension, but it’s the good kind.

She’s not sure whether I’m not interested or interested but deliberately fucking with her head.

The Take Away

Five minutes into the conversation, her friend shows up, another hot girl.

My girl says hello and introduces me. I compliment the new woman on her outfit, then:

Me: “Ok, you have to talk to your friend. I also have a friend here and I am going to go catch up with him.”

Her: “You don’t have to.”

Me: “I have to. It’s called friendship.”

Her: “I might not be here when you get back.”

Me: “That’s a chance I’m going to have to take. Remember this word, friendship.”

I smile and give her a hug, then walk away.

Taking Charge

I go sit with Eric on one of the couches. We talk for a while.

The woman makes sure to stay in my field of vision the whole time.

I ignore her.

Finally, she and her friends sit right near us. I tell her to switch seats with her friend so she can be next to me.

I also tell Eric to go sit next to the hot friend. By arranging everyone this way, I create the illusion that I am in charge.

Looking For Big Indicator of Interest

I spend another ten minutes chatting with her, and sometimes with her pals.

Eric is winging but is now hitting on the hottie friend, so I feel no pressure at all.

This time, my woman excuses herself to go to the bathroom with her friend.

When she comes back, her hair is down again, looking super sexy.

Big indication of interest.

We talk some more. I’m at peak energy in this interaction. What should I do?

The Exit

At peak energy, there are only two places to go: 1) the bedroom, or 2) lower energy.

She’s with friends, one of whom she hasn’t seen in a while.

Even if all I wanted was a hookup – which I don’t – the logistics are bad.

I’d have to abandon my friend, a demonstration of lower value. She’d have to abandon her friends who all want to stay out.

It’s not a good plan.

Instead, I’m going to take this opportunity to do the one thing she least expects. I leave.

I stand up and motion for her to stand up. I hug her and whisper in her ear:

Me: “I’m leaving.”

Her: “What? Why?”

Me: “Gotta get up early. I’m an old man. I need plenty of sleep.”

Her: “Oh you suck.”

Me: “Hey, you’ve heard of this thing… (pause) The Internet?”

She laughs.

I do my funny card close (previously posted somewhere on this site).

She plays along, but she’s not taking my card.

She’s fumbling in her purse for her own card. It’s a business card so she runs off to ask the bartender for a pen to write her personal cell phone.

I hug her and kiss her on the cheek. She goes in for a kiss, but I deliberately pull my head back just enough to deny her contact.

We both crack up and she shakes her head and smiles.

I guarantee all of you that that has never, ever happened to that woman before or since.

The Text Game

The text game is easy because I’ve done all of the work up front. I took all of my chances in the first ten minutes.

There is little left to do.

This texting is way more than I like to do, but it still manages to set the right tone.

One day later, I text her, but without my name. So she doesn’t know who sent the text:

Me: “the adventure begins”

Her: “And so it does ;)

Me: “brave of you to respond like that to a number you didn’t recognize. :-) but that is the impression i got of you, fearless”

Her: “Well I don’t always go around and have conversations like that with people.”

Me: “we actually didn’t say much to each other but there were definitely some electrons exchanged”

Her: “Yes, there were definitely some electrons exchanged. Maybe some protons too…”

Me: “ha! well that was the easy part. now we have to figure out whether we actually get along. ever been to pegu?”

Her: “I have not. Where is that?”

Me: “houston, just east of west broadway. great cocktails. quiet. a good place to kill an hour talking about the examined life”

Her: “Sounds cool. I leave to go visit family and friends in Philadelphia Saturday. What is your work schedule like? I work from home so I’m pretty flexible and can even meet during the day.”

Me: “i am the master of the universe. i laugh at schedules. i will write back with a good time. be patient and don’t flirt with other boys”

Her: “Ha!”

Me: (Next day, 10 hours later) “tomorrow’s no good. i box on fridays so i will have a big red swollen nose. and then you’re gone. so today at 6 or monday at 6. i will be bringing a hurricane of charm. will your levees hold up?”

Her: “Monday at 6 works better; my gf is still here now. I have been told that I am pretty charming myself. Is Pegu big enough to hold the two of us?”

Me: “i’ll have to leave my ego outside. mon @ 6. epiphanies shall rain from the heavens!”

Some important things to note about this text thread:

1. I text her without my name so she doesn’t know who is texting her. She responds anyway so it’s on.

2. I tell her there was chemistry (pull), but then I take it away by saying that now comes the hard part – we have to figure out whether we actually get along (push).

3. I never actually ask her out. I just tell her I know a good place. She says she’s available any time. That’s the kind of motivation I like!

4. I tell her up front the date will be short – an hour. Most men want more time. I am the prize. I want less time.

5. I tell her to wait for me to suggest a time. It’s bullshit. I knew when I was available, but the waiting builds tension, so I don’t text back until the next morning.

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posted in Attraction, Banter, Text and Phone Game

COMMENTS
23 responses
Backstreets says:

…MONEY !

chrys says:

nice plan lee.. Eric has thhhe spirit and you have the great plans… nice job from both of you.. tell us how it ends..!

Genius says:

@lee very nice post sir… lots a great value i have got from this… i say you take this site from eric.. lol jk… eric has some gems too

Ben says:

Hey Lee, I have been reading this blog for a while and this has been another great post. I have question to ask you regarding attracting and meeting women. This going to be hypothetical mind you. We are always told not to be the nice guy and I really understand why this is. But in response to this most men would think that the compete opposite(being a jerk or asshole) will help them attract, and although it looks like they have sucsess in acting like an asshole. The women that they meet are usually of low quality. So obviously there is a healthy balance that need to be meet – a sort of halfway point between the nice guy and a-hole(but I understand those aren’t the only male arcetypes in existance, just extremes to prove a point). But what I getting at and what my question is, is how much of attracting women is about behaving in the opposite fashion as every other guy she has encountered. In other word my hypothetical question is “if every guy treated women the way that you treat them how would set your sell apart?. By just doing the opposite?” And if so let’s assume the you knew that every single time that a certian women had been approached her whole life or maybe just that night in one paticular way would you do the opposite of what you knew those men had done just to separate yourself or ‘stand out’ extremely(hence the reasoning behind doing the opposite). The reason I ask this is because I fell that humans are psychologically predisposed be attracted to something or someone thats “different”. If that’s true than if every man on the planet behaved the way you and Eric prescrib(which I like by the way) and that was like the new baseline of an “attractive man” how would a women chose any particualr one. Kind of like, the all things being equal arguement. Like if I guy had to chose between ten identically physically attractive women how who chose which to date. Since looks are the first critirea that most men -and the guy choosing- will check for first then the second thing that he would look for is personality maybe.
I realize as I am typing this that it’s a stupid question because for a guy you could have to qirls in front of you and one with average looks but a great personality. And the another has smokin looks and a shitty personality and girl with the personality could be sexy as hell. So I guess attraction isn’t that cut a dry. I mean the variable that are involved in the human mating process and unbelievable. I guess I am just trying to make sense of it but I fear that be a losing battle. I appreciate your thoughts and look forward to hearing your response. Thanks.

Lee says:

@Ben

The biggest benefit of using negative game is not differentiation, although that is certainly one of the benefits. The biggest benefit is the attraction that is generated when a man is not immediately smitten with a beautiful woman. Beautiful women have come to associate that behavior with the most desirable and most selective men, men who have many romantic options. This is rational. When a man has many romantic options, he is slow to become emotionally invested in someone new. He is a little skeptical that the woman standing in front of him brings enough value to become an important part of his life, no matter how beautiful she is. He is constantly testing women to see whether they have the appropriate interests, personalities, skills, emotions, etc. to make them interesting to him.

Why does this work? It works because it’s hard to mimic this behavior. If a man does not legitimately feel that he is the prize, he will have trouble subjecting women to the kind of skepticism that seems natural for the most desirable men.

Now, why does differentiation contribute to the success of negative game? Why is being different in and of itself attractive? To understand this, you have to think about what men fear. In a nutshell, they fear judgement. There are four sources of judgement: 1) judgement by women, 2) judgement by our friends, 3) judgement by the crowd that witnesses our failure, and 4) our own judgement of ourselves.

That is why wearing a piece of clothing that attracts a lot of attention is so difficult for men who are shy. They don’t want to stand out. They want to hide.

Women are also looking to see whether a man is sensitive to judgement. The most desirable men are less sensitive to the judgement of others. They are natural risk takers. They march to the beat of their own drum and are confident enough that what they are doing will work, irrespective of what others think.

To get back to your question, I suppose when enough men use negative game, it will become less of a differentiator. But that may not happen for generations, much less the time frames that are important to the men of today.

Zoroaster says:

How do you overcome sensitivity to judgement?

I am very accomplished for my own age. But I also have glaring weaknesses. I still take huge-risks regardless. But I am constantly exposed to judgement from those four groups that undermine my confidence and value before others, despite what I have done. My accomplishments are always made secondary to my minor human flaws by others. I can’t help but notice that all that I’m good at and what I’ve done is not appreciated or valued by women at all.

These days I barely even have any male friends because it always turns into a one-sided dick-measuring contest. I’m always below their heel or I need to be usurped from my position. And part of the reason for this appears to be the fact that I am not witty, quick minded and able to shoot my mouth off to insult people. And I’m not good at defending myself. So I’m an easy target for their beta-aggressiveness. I actually hide my own awesomeness like it’s a curse. What can I do?

Lee says:

@Zoroaster

I feel you, brother. I also had a bunch of friends that offered me no support. I finally read this book called “Friendship, An Expose” and realized that these were not real friends. I wound up cutting off most of them and keeping a small group of close friends who really want to see me succeed. Pickup is particularly hard on friendships because it entails so many identity issues. It’s common for married friends or friends in long term relationships – especially men who have made some compromises – to hope you fail because it makes them feel happier about their own situations.

Regarding the judgement of women about your accomplishments, women are much more interested in determining that you are passionate about what you do than they are in actually understanding what you do. You have to find a way of relating that excitement to them and not dwelling on whether they actually get the details. You need a good identity story. I can share mine with you, if you like. It will give you an example, based up which you can write your own.

Eric’s book – which is due out next month – has great exercises for making yourself less sensitive to the judgement of others. It’s a much less expensive option than taking a workshop or seeking out private coaching.

–Lee

MrAntiquity says:

@Zoroaster–

I’ve suffered some of the same problems–and come a LONG way in pretty much eliminating them. Basically, I was always an insecure kid growing up–I had a lot of friends (and many good friends–but some who were as you describe as well). Because I sucked with girls, though, I needed to use the group in order to interact a bit more–but at the same time I was sometimes a bit of a doormat.

So I wanted to hang out with these people–but they often made me feel like crap–this was both my fault as well as theirs.

The more I discovered who I was–call it identity, individuality, awesomeness, whatever you like–the more I realized that my identity had to do with ME–not with THEM. So I could pick up and leave them at any time–and choose either to return, or not. As I did that–and took my own track through graduate programs and now a doctorate, while traveling extensively, playing music, and doing just all-around cool things that I had wanted to do since I was 7, my level of self-respect–AS WELL AS other people’s respect for me–shot through the roof.

I’m my own person now–still have a lot of friends, but no ‘best ‘friend’ and no ‘group’ any more–and I’ve moved myself to the periphery of those old situations–both geographically and psychologically.

That was REALLY long winded–but I think pretty important.

The short version?? ‘Know thyself’ :)

Zoroaster says:

Thank you both Lee and MrAntiquity for your answers. They were very helpful.

@ MrAntiquity: It seems that the solution is just not be dependent on people at all for validation. Friends and women alike. But don’t most people need some sort of best friend or group to demonstrate their social value? Did your level of self-respect get other people’s respect?

@ Lee: It would be awesome to hear your identity story. I have no clue where to start mine. I understand the importance of presentation and marketing, but have never been too good at it.

I’m always impatient for Eric’s next post. So I’d be stupid not to pick up a copy of his book. I hope it will be available on Amazon.

cairo says:

Zoroaster, I really identified with everything you talked about.

There’s an awesome book called The Gifts of Imperfection …it talks about our fear of being judged, being “OK” with your imperfections, celebrating your gifts/strengths, showcasing vulnerability, and a bunch of other related topics.

Here’s a TED talk from the author: http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/en/brene_brown_on_vulnerability.html

MrAntiquity says:

@Zoroaster–

Couple of things:

1. I do have a lot of friends–and some friends that I’m close with. I’m not a loner by any means. But I think that the group membership idea that often surfaces in ‘PUA’ land (the ‘entourage’ mentality) is, frankly, pretty immature and relies on superficiality to ‘get’ girls–rather than one’s own personal merits.

I’ve obviously posted on here a about my own deal with women–but that’s not about women not being attracted–it’s about me holding myself back for other reasons.

But I see myself as an interesting person, who has done lots of really cool things–for myself as an individual–not for anybody else. Women sense that–and it doesn’t matter if you’re a loner, or a super-extrovert–or whatever….if you’re comfortable with who you are, you WILL be attractive–not just to women, but to people in general. That’s the ultimate social value in itself :)

Ray says:

you are lucky, you sound like the lion hunting his prey, some people out there (like myself) are inferior males (maybe inferior humans) we have no game, women avoid us, we simply cannot make our selves stand out do to fear of rejection. rejection takes more of a toll on a man’s self esteem than loosing a war. Once you have been rejected enough you fear it and don’t dare to face it again… simply we die off

Andy says:

@Lee, this is fantastic.

But something about it bothers me. With enough practice, most people could learn to present themselves as this “skeptical man with many options” who is always testing her, as you were mentioning in the comments above, but when does it stop? That is, assuming you’re looking for some type of long term relationship, when does all the posturing stop? (eg ok I need to make sure at some point in the evening I do something like rearrange where people are sitting so it looks like I’m in charge)

When is it ok to just be yourself around her and not even think about how you are presenting yourself to her? I think in the long term, this would be exhausting to keep up.

Mark says:

@Andy

If I may intercede. To quote Hitch: “YOU is a very fluid concept right now”. Firstly, it never stops. This isn’t really a “game” in a sense. It’s about becoming a better, more confident version of yourself. The things that the community teaches us are a foundation of the “alpha male” way of life. Learn it, become it, and then you won’t need to try. You’ll never keep the girl if you shoot her a couple of techniques and then relax into a needy wuss-bag. Change is always hard, but necessary if your life isn’t where it should be.

Lee says:

@Mark

So so true. Good post.

–Lee

Lee says:

@Andy

Gimmicks like rearranging where people are sitting should really stop after the second date. These are tricks that are used to create a certain type of experience for a woman, an experience that leaves her excited to learn more about you. Once she is willing to do that, there is no need for gimmicks.

The bigger and more interesting question is when game should stop. To this, I say never. I define game as all of the things we do to keep our romantic partners interested and entertained. Game should continue into your marriage. More marriages break up because of boredom than because of cheating. There are plenty of cool studies that show even cheating is the result of boredom.

When a woman feels that she no longer has to keep growing, improving, and being attractive (not only to you but to strangers as well), your romance is over. In my last relationship, I took up dancing, started to work out more regularly, worked harder – all due to the fact that the woman I was with made me want to be a better man. That pressure – that sense that you have to be a better person to keep this woman – and that she has to do the same to keep you – is game. Happiness in love is not absolute security – that’s what leads to obesity and hair curlers. Happiness in love is that sense that you are with someone who deserves to be with the very best you.

Keep playing, my friend.

–Lee

Norice says:

Lee, need some help here, what happens when the text game falls flat straight after the opener. I mean I tried using what you did (same situation but got her no off an online dating site. We had sufficient rapport there, just wanted to take things offline), “The journey begins” and she replies “thats so cheesy haha”, so I followed up with the next line on texting strangers and it fell flat.

I think the question is how do we kickstart a flat text game. The end goal is to meet the girl, not just text I guess?

Lee says:

@Norice

Text game works when you have some leverage with a girl, some attraction and connection already in place. If the very first thing that a girl says to you is no, there is not much you can do to move the interaction along. I would move on.

–Lee

Lee says:

I want to expand a little on my answer. The texts that I send work very well with the girls I meet because they expect them from me. Look at the interaction I had with that girl. I was definitely on the receiving end of her interest, not the other way around. However, if you started your interaction with a girl by chasing her, and then suddenly send her a ballsy text like the above, it is less likely to go well. You haven’t established yourself as the type of person who can do that, which may be why she reacted badly. In general, it’s hard to play this kind of high value game in an online dating environment because you get no points for contacting girls the way every other guy does. You get major points for approaching girls in real life with a ballsy opener. Online, I would either tone it down, or be prepared to lose lots of girls on the way to finding a few spectacular successes.

–Lee

Alex_B says:

Hey Lee are there any ways to apply the stuff we learn here in the online environment? Like messages and stuff like that. Or is it just best to stay with the real world approaches?

Norice says:

Great advice. Point taken. I thought I had some attraction going prior to that in the email exchange but guess nothing beats solid interaction in real life. The next time, I guess some experimentation is required online. Then again I should go out and do approaches as that seems to be better for the interaction and demonstrating real value.

Thanks alot Lee. It was enlightening.

patrick says:

Tight game. I box as well. Useful to randomly drop in.

Samy says:

Lee, I am in the process of developing my identity story, can you share your story with us? Thanks!

Lee wrote:
“You need a good identity story. I can share mine with you, if you like. It will give you an example, based up which you can write your own.”

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